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New discovery well new to me at least Rate Topic: -----

#1 User is offline   ponch Icon

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Posted 16 April 2004 - 03:46 PM

tune your low E down to a Low Low D and have fun...
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#2 User is offline   dadfad Icon

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Posted 16 April 2004 - 04:43 PM

Yes, it's called Dropped-D tuning. Some people use it just to make easy one-finger power barre-chords, but it was originally used to play complex fingerstyle tunes where you wanted a bass-drone. I did an experiment sort of to try messing with Soundclick and put up a tune in Dropped-D on it (actually the guitar was tuned a half step lower to Dropped-Db but it's the same thing. Just a little deeper). Here it is if you want to listen to it..........

Dropped-D (Db)
Un-plugged is not the same as
never-was-plugged-in-to-begin-with.

John Jackson -My Teacher and My Old Friend

When the roll is called up yonder he'll be there
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#3 User is offline   annoying_2001 Icon

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Posted 16 April 2004 - 04:51 PM

that soungs great john!

is there any chance you could post that tab up here?
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yeah, he's that cool
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#4 User is offline   dadfad Icon

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Posted 16 April 2004 - 05:14 PM

Thanks! It was just sort of an improv'ed thing in dropped-D where I pretty much just stole....er.....improvised a few licks from other people's dropped-D styles over the years. A little Turlogh O'Carolan, Jodie Stecher, Robert Pete Williams, Blind Willie McTell, Lonnie Johnson, Robert Johnson, Jorma Kaukonan....anybody I could think of who did something in dropped-D kind of blended together. I probably could tab it. Is there any particular part or style of that whole piece that you like best? I could tell you where I stole...er....improv'ed it from and tab the whole tune. For example, the first thirty-one seconds is basically from this tune.......

CODE
#---------------------------------PLEASE NOTE--------------------------------#
# This transcription is the author's own work and represents his interpret-  #
# tation of the song. It is intended for private study, scholarship and/or   #
# research purposes only and is not intended for publication or distribution.#
#----------------------------------------------------------------------------#

Si Bagh An Si Mor (Traditional Gaelic/Celtic Melody) in the Key Of D
Arranged by John M. (Dadfad) 10/7/02 (Using Notepad Courier New 10 Font)

The tune is called by many similar names, "Sheebeg and Sheemore", etc.
This is a frequently played and requested tune among Traditional-Celtic
guitarists and Traditional-Celtic audiences. It's been done by a number
of artists, in various keys in various tunings with varying degrees of
difficulty. I've used Dropped-D (DADGBE) because it seems like the most
commonly heard tuning for this piece. The tab below isn't that difficult,
but is still true enough to the theme and full enough so that it easily
may be used either as a finished tune, or merely as a basis to elaborate
on. Where I think it may help I'll try to describe holding positions or
fingering suggestions that might make it easier to play. Any fingerstyle
guitar is difficult to tab and even more difficult to play from tab, but
I'll try to make it as clear and understandable as possible.


(holding a D-chord 000232 to start....)


E)_________0___0h2______0___________0h2__________
B)_____3____________________3__3_________3_______
G)_________2_________________________2___________
D)_____0____________0_______0__0_________0_______
A)_______________________________________________
D)______________0_______0________________________

#1>    A            B   |----------C-------|


E)_______________________________________________
B)______0_____________0____2___3________3________
G)_____________0_______________________(2)_______
D)__________0_________0____2_______0_____________
A)_____(5)_____________________________(0)_______
D)______5______________________0________0________

#2>     A           |-----B----|   C    D


E)______________________________________0___0h2___2h3p2___0__
B)________0___________0____2__3______3______(3)_____3_____2__
G)___2___(0)______0__(0)________________0___0h2_____2_____0__
D)__(0)________0___________2_____0___2____________________2__
A)_______(5)_________(5)______2___________________________0__
D)___0____5___________5______________________________________

#3>                                          A      B     C


E)__2_______________0_______________________________________
B)______0___________________________3_______3___2_____3_____
G)__0__________0________2_______2_______0____________(2)____
D)__2_______0_______2__(0)___0______2_______2_______________
A)_____(5)_____________(0)______________0_______0____(0)____
D)______5_______________0_____________________________0_____

#4> A   B           C   D         |-------E------|    F


E)___2_____5_____7___________3___0____________________________
B)__(3)___(3)_________________________3______2____3___3_____3_
G)_________2____________0________0___(0)__________2______2__2_
D)___0_______________0_______0_______(2)__2__2___(0)__0_____0_
A)______________(5)___________________0___________0______0__0_
D)_______________5________________________________0_________0_

#5>  A     B     C           D   E   |----F----|  G  |---H---|

Now the second round of the theme starts, similar to the first.


E)_________0___0h2______0___________0h2___5______
B)_____3____________________3__3_________________
G)_________2_________________________2___________
D)_____0____________0_______0__0__________0______
A)_______________________________________________
D)______________0_______0________________________

#6>



E)______7____________5_____0h2______0h2__0_______0___0h2___0______
B)__________________________3________________3________________3___
G)______________0___________________0h2__0_______2_________0______
D)__________0________2__________0____________0________0_______0___
A)_____(5)__________________0_____________________________________
D)______5___________________0_____________________________________

#7>


E)______________________2________________0____________________________
B)____0_________0____________0___________________3______3___2___3_____
G)__________0_______2_______________0________2_______0__________2_____
D)_______0______0__(2)___________0_______2___0___2______2___2_______3_
A)____5_____________0___2___(5)______________________0__________0_____
D)____5______________________5_______________0__________________0_____

#8>


E)____2____5____7__________3___0______________________
B)__________________________________3_______2____3____
G)____2____2___________0_________________________2____
D)__________________0______0___2___(2)__2___2____0____
A)__________________________________0____________0____
D)______________5________________________________0____

#9>


E)____2h3p2____0_____2________________
B)______3____________3________________
G)______2______0_____2________________
D)___________________0________________
A)___________________0________________
D)___________________0_____12(harm)___

#10> A trill and end flourish in full D

Now, I'll try describing as much as possible what is being done in the positions
of the tune. I'll use a number with a letter (the letters underneath) to show
approximate location of what I'm describing (like 1A or 8D, etc) on the line
below each tab-staff. Anyway...

-1A is a pinch with the thumb and first finger. This is the basic technique of
this entire tune, so I won't describe every pinch. Assume it likely is unless
I show otherwise.
-1B is a roll. After you come out of a pinch, you frequenly "roll" to add some
texture to the tune. You generally use your thumb to do it. I'm not going to
show every roll either. When you see a succession of single notes, usually
going downward (toward your lap) it's probably a roll.
-1C is just more pinches. Note the 0h2 (hammer from open to 2nd fret, which
is used in several other areas too).
-2A This is a G chord-form. (This is a very frequently-used G-form in finger-
style Dropped-D). It is most easily played just by using your thumb around
the neck on the 6 (and 5) strings, 5th fret. Pinch that with the open 2-string.
The (5) in parenthesis means that note may be sounded with the un-parenthesed  
note, usually by just sort of extending or dragging the pinch a bit. Roll to..
-2B is more pinches going into a rolled note (2C). Go into sort of holding a  
D-chord but then just pinch that 2-string/3-fret and open 6-string part, then
a little roll on the open 4-string as you go to play a fairly full D-chord...
-2D, which is dragged from both directions (trying to sound the (0) and the (2).

(I don't think I need to describe every pinch and roll now, unless its unusual
in some way. Just the information about the first two lines explains most of
what is meant in the rest of the tune.)

-3A is a double-string hammer. Not difficult, just hold the 2-string/3rd-fret
note with your ring finger and hammer your first and middle finger into a
regular D-chord shape.
-3B is a trill. A little tricky, depending on your experience with them. You
hold the 1st-string/2nd-fret hand hammer-on the 3rd-fret then pull it back off
slightly plucking it with your finger tip if necessary to sound all three notes
of the trill clearly.
-3C is an A7 chord that can be thumb-strummed down.
-4A is a continuation of that A7, but now with an added F# (1-string/2nd-fret)
which adds sort of a diminished/sixth feel taking you to...
-4B which is, again, a G-chord. Then to....
-4C which is back to an A chord-form fragment (A7) and then on to...
-4D which is a D-chord, giving a feeling of partial resolution,
-4E rolling back again through other partial A-forms (Asus4 fragment to A7
again) and then...
-4F back to the D. Then sort of a little end-line...
-5A starting in a D-shape and...
-5B adding the 12th note (A) to that D by extending the pinkie down to the
first-string/fifth-fret to catch it. Then to...
-5C the G-chord. Again, holding the 5 and 6 strings/5th fret with your thumb
allows you to reach the 1-string/7th-fret (adding an 11th note B). (Just a
note: using that thumb for your G-chord gives you a great range of what you
can do with your other fingers when playing in Dropped-D in any style.) Roll
that G-form into...
-5D which is also part of a G-major chord. Roll into...
-5E which is a D, and into...
-5F which is again Asus4 to A7. Then...
-5G a rich D-chord, either using a full pinch to catch all five strings.
-5H is just a little repetitive end-tag of a couple of two-string pinches and
a final slightly arpeggiated strum as to allow all five notes to be he heard.

That more or less explains the first section. There isn't much reason to
go over the next section lines #6, #7, #8, and #9, which, while different,
are done using the same techniqes through the same progression.
-10 is just a trill and flourish ending on a full, rich slightly arpeggiated
D-chord, topped of with a D-harmonic on the 6-string/12th-fret (if you
want to put it there!)

And that's pretty much it. You can use that dominant theme to improv more
verses or repeat them or whatever. Anyway that covers the theme melody of the
piece. It's all done in a I, IV, V progression of forms of D, G and A. You
should listen to one or more versions of the tune to get a sense of how it
flows. If you visualize, while you're playing it, that you're in one of those
positions, instead of just a series of riffs, it makes it much easier to work
with and especially to improvise on further. Maybe just a simple strumming
pattern of the positions would make it easier to associate the passages to the
progression. It would pretty much be like this:

DDD DDD GGG D

GGG DDD GGG A

D G A D

GGG AAA D

That's more-less the feel of the progression (there are little variances but
that's close). If you can see the pinches and rolls, etc as being made within
those D, G or A positions, it all sort of flows from that point. In any case,
that's it. I hope I explained it well enough to make some kind of sense! Any
questions, just ask. Good luck. -Dadfad


And I got the rest from other tunes and artists pretty much the same way and just sort of did a medley of them.
Un-plugged is not the same as
never-was-plugged-in-to-begin-with.

John Jackson -My Teacher and My Old Friend

When the roll is called up yonder he'll be there
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#5 User is offline   annoying_2001 Icon

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Posted 16 April 2004 - 06:48 PM

alright, very cool. i'll check it out. thanks again john.
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yeah, he's that cool
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#6 User is offline   ee40oztofreedom Icon

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Posted 19 April 2004 - 12:07 AM

that song is bad ass
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#7 User is offline   jshrel24 Icon

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 12:20 AM

thats awesome dadfad. that tab w/ the instructions at teh bottom is great . awesome stuff
Josh.
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#8 User is offline   dadfad Icon

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 08:10 AM

Thanks guys! smile.gif I've liked dropped-D for a long time. I hated it when it started becoming known as like a cheater-tuning for low-skilled one-finger barre-chords. I remember about ten or so years ago before I knew it was becoming used for stuff like that, this younger punk-guy wanted to learn a little about traditional country-blues and before we started actual lessons I mentioned different tunings a little. When I mentioned dropped-D he said "Yeah, I can already play in dropped-D" and I thought "Cool, he must already have some decent fingerstyle skills." Damn, I was pretty surprised when I found out what he meant by already able to play in dropped-D. It sure wasn't Lonnie Johnson stuff he was talking about! laugh.gif


(But that led to me playing at my first (and only!) "rave". Him and his band wanted me to do "cool harp sh!t" with them for a set. I'd never played harp with flange, delay and distortion before through four-hundred watts. It was a pretty cool/unusual experience, standing between two columns of cabs playing harp to people dressed in black, jumping around in a dark smokey dungeon!) (Damn, I'm getting old! laugh.gif )
Un-plugged is not the same as
never-was-plugged-in-to-begin-with.

John Jackson -My Teacher and My Old Friend

When the roll is called up yonder he'll be there
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#9 User is offline   wannalearn01 Icon

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 08:48 AM

Naw DADFAD, your not getting old...the world is getting younger wink.gif

I have yet to experiment with different tunings, but I figure I should get the standard one down first.

Would you suggest a begginer, about 8 months of good practicing, mess with different tunings or would it be better to save that one for a little later?

Thanks,

T^roy
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Imagination is more powerful than any knowledge-Einstein

GTU Member of the week July 19, 2004, 875 posts

There is a fine line between insanity and genius and I think i crossed it...but what side I am on is still unclear.
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#10 User is offline   dadfad Icon

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 09:34 AM

It wouldn't hurt. Dropped-D is probably the easiest of course (I barely think of it as special, being so close to standard tuning). Open D (DADF#AD) is a good one also. Lots of tunes (newer and older) are done in it. You can begin to mess with a slide in it. And it relates closely to other tunings. It plays identically to open-E and plays similarly to open-G or open-A (the same fingerings just moved over one string). An extremely easy way to get into altered tunings slightly if you have a trigger-type capo (Keyser, etc) is just to put your capo on the second fret but only on the first five strings. This will, in effect, now give you "dropped-E", which will play like dropped-D. A D-chord shape (from the capo) of 000232 will now be an E-chord. For your A (now shaped like a G) use 320003, and for your B-chord (now shaped like an A) use X02220. You get the same richness of dropped-D, yet the other chords finger in a standard way. Open and altered tunings open up totally new areas of the guitar, especially in acoustic guitar. This is a good reason to have multiple guitars (even if some of them are yard-sale cheapies). You can leave a guitar always in that altered tuning and then you are much more likely to practice the tuning than if you had to re-tune all the time, only re-tuning your "main guitar" for a gig or a more special situation.
Un-plugged is not the same as
never-was-plugged-in-to-begin-with.

John Jackson -My Teacher and My Old Friend

When the roll is called up yonder he'll be there
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#11 User is offline   wannalearn01 Icon

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 12:18 PM

Ok so this might sound completely stupid but...

How would I tune to a F # on a tuner that is one with a needle gauge...I always match it up with the green light and it only has options for whole notes?

T^roy
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Imagination is more powerful than any knowledge-Einstein

GTU Member of the week July 19, 2004, 875 posts

There is a fine line between insanity and genius and I think i crossed it...but what side I am on is still unclear.
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#12 User is offline   dadfad Icon

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Posted 20 April 2004 - 01:37 PM

Tune your 3-string down to match the note of the D-4-string held on the 4th fret, which is an F#. (And it's not stupid. We ALL had to learn.)
Un-plugged is not the same as
never-was-plugged-in-to-begin-with.

John Jackson -My Teacher and My Old Friend

When the roll is called up yonder he'll be there
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#13 User is offline   BaasLian Icon

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Posted 21 April 2004 - 02:24 AM

Dadfad, it took me literally hours to get that song to play on my PC. But it was definately worth the wait. Maybe I'm just being very dramatic, but it gave me goosebumps just listening to it! rolleyes.gif

The clock of life is wound but once
And no man has the power to tell just when the hands will stop at late or early hour
Now is the only time you own
Live, love, toil with a will
Place no faith in time
For the clock may soon be still
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#14 User is offline   dadfad Icon

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Posted 21 April 2004 - 06:19 AM

Thanks for the very kind words, Lian. I wasn't really happy with it because, having tuned down to Db, the parameters of the recorder very often couldn't quite pick up all of the lowest bass-notes, so thoughout a lot of the tune only half of the bass-line (the second-octave Db) is heard. But I was (and still am) experimenting with Soundclick and the Edit-Pro recorder and all of that (I'm pretty bad with computer technical stuff) and just wanted to see if I could actually get a tune to work on there. Again, thanks. I appreciate that. smile.gif
Un-plugged is not the same as
never-was-plugged-in-to-begin-with.

John Jackson -My Teacher and My Old Friend

When the roll is called up yonder he'll be there
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