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Statement Regarding Legality of TabsWhat I have to say...


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#41 Graeme! Yes, Graeme!

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 07:52 PM

Why are so many people in this thread first time posters?

#42 in_repair

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 07:55 PM

I was wondering that too. Then I realized it was to trivial to actually bug me so I half disregarded it.


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#43 floydian89

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 07:58 PM

QUOTE (gibson123 @ Jul 17 2006, 05:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
wow!!! This sucks. All us young musicians are trying to improve our techniques and teach others as well. I don't understand how these tabs are copyright infringement, it makes no sense what so ever. there one persons interpretation of a song and sites like these help sell original sheet music. Someone gets mad cause the tab doesnt sound right they buy the book. Whats the difference of looking up the tab on the internet and playing it or going down to the music store and sitting there for a few ours with a tab book in front of you learning your favorite song then leaving without purchesing the book. Is this the kind of thing us musicians are going to have to revert to. some one from the MPA was smoking to much weed or something and didn't think this through. Now many people will loose interest in their instrument because they will become frusterated and stuck and give up. We cant let this happen. KEEP FIGHTING. Tabs are not illegal!!! this sounds like a company trying to make money and become a monopoly. Peace

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couldn't have put it better myself

#44 blackened10

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 08:14 PM

QUOTE (Graeme! Yes, Graeme! @ Jul 17 2006, 10:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why are so many people in this thread first time posters?

probably because they came only for the tabs... went to look at a tab and saw that it said that its been taken out... and i guess its a url... so they clicked on it and it brings u to this topic... so i guess they got pissed...
and wanted to pay homage


its kinda like atheists praying to god before the end of the world
you no... just to say they could be part of it

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#45 floydian89

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 08:21 PM

yeah, this is ridiculous. the only way I know how to read music is by tabs and i've learned all the songs i know from this site and others. i dont understand what the point of taking down tab sites is when there are much better things they could be doing but i guess it all comes down to their greed. they cant get their money from hard work so they gotta get it by screwing over anyone they can. the real question is is it even possible to win the battle against them??? how can you do it???

I urge everyone who reads this to go to www.mpa.org and read what they have to say about all this. they've got some bull###### answer to everything that doesnt even give a solution and just masks the issue.

Edited by floydian89, 17 July 2006 - 08:47 PM.


#46 doomsdayjesus

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 09:15 PM

what a load of crap...people are so against any of the good things the internet is good for.Lets just have child porn and snuff clips...not music for people to learn and try to better the world with what we can all learn from the great music we all get from here.everybody don't stop rockin'...just don't get caught by someone showing your buddy a riff......you might have to pay for it.bands should now not be allowed to show the fans at their shows how they are playing their songs because it might end up on the internet...thats all i've got...rock on...RIP Dime cheers.gif guitar.gif

#47 blackened10

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 09:17 PM

QUOTE (doomsdayjesus @ Jul 18 2006, 12:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
what a load of crap...people are so against any of the good things the internet is good for.Lets just have child porn and snuff clips...not music for people to learn and try to better the world with what we can all learn from the great music we all get from here.everybody don't stop rockin'...just don't get caught by someone showing your buddy a riff......you might have to pay for it.bands should now not be allowed to show the fans at their shows how they are playing their songs because it might end up on the internet...thats all i've got...rock on...RIP Dime cheers.gif guitar.gif


nice first post... welcome and good bye to GTU! biggrin.gif

just kidding

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#48 domepiece

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 09:27 PM

i dont think it is illegal for tabs , it should only be illegal if you are turing a profit by doing so.... this is wack

#49 doomsdayjesus

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 09:41 PM

QUOTE (blackened10 @ Jul 18 2006, 01:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (doomsdayjesus @ Jul 18 2006, 12:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

what a load of crap...people are so against any of the good things the internet is good for.Lets just have child porn and snuff clips...not music for people to learn and try to better the world with what we can all learn from the great music we all get from here.everybody don't stop rockin'...just don't get caught by someone showing your buddy a riff......you might have to pay for it.bands should now not be allowed to show the fans at their shows how they are playing their songs because it might end up on the internet...thats all i've got...rock on...RIP Dime cheers.gif guitar.gif


nice first post... welcome and good bye to GTU! biggrin.gif

just kidding



i've been here for quite a while but I don't post much...just here to learn ... drink.gif

#50 foamingpigeon

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 09:56 PM

This is seriously frickin' ridiculous. I don't think I've seen one tab on any tab site that was straight out of a music book. People listen to them and figure them out and then post them. They are rarely 100% correct. It's not at all different than telling your buddy how to play a song. And when I really want to know the right way to play a few songs, I go out and get a book. Tab sites are excellent for teaching how to play guitar. I learned everything I know from internet tab sites. I have never had a lesson. Sure my friends gave a little input, but not as much as tab sites have given me. You know, if I absolutely have to listen to a song over and over to figure it out, I will, but don't expect me to buy a book if that's the way it's going to be. I really feel bad for the beginners. What are they supposed to do? They're just starting out and the best way to learn to play is being taken from them. I can figure out a song just fine and play it, but it's going to be really discouraging for beginners to know that they have to figure it all out on their own. Especially the beginners that can't afford to buy a music book or pay for lessons. When I started, I had to learn on my mom's old acoustic with the aid of cyberfret.com and online tab sites because I couldn't afford my own guitar or lessons. If I have to donate money to keep online tab sites running, I will, but I will never buy another music book if they take away free online tabs. I'll even burn the ones I own at the main doors of Guitar Center.

#51 imadique

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 10:11 PM

QUOTE (MagMa @ Jul 18 2006, 09:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
To MPA.org
I was very disheartened to learn that your organization has effectively shut down the website Guitar Tab Universe based on the false pretext of copyright infringement. In order for a copyright to be infringed, it must be registered and published. I can assure you that many of these songs are not.



errrr.....wot?

Don't wanna burst your bubble but I can't help but think that a large part of your letter was a bit uninformed. Any song that has been released is then a published song. The composer doesn't have to have a publishing deal for it to be published (if they don't you see the word Control or just nothing on the album credits). Now I'll admit I haven't browsed the tabs for a very long time, but unless things have changed dramatically every song on this site is a commercially released song; There was a couple of songs by GTU members snuck into the database but as far as I'm aware they weren't really supposed to be in there. Therefore, every song in the database except the sneaky ones is a published song.

That's not really the point though, the point is that sheet music is one of, if not the smallest part of publishing income. I don't want to dig through my handouts from last year but I remember from the module we did on publishing contracts that it was basically a negligible amount. The main thing music publishers do is negotiate contracts to place their clients songs in advertisements or in movies and on compilation cd's and all that stuff. Sheet music is a tiny sliver of the pie chart, so I don't understand why they have their knickers in a twist over such an illogical argument other than just for reasons of pure greed.


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#52 rkpilot

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Posted 17 July 2006 - 10:21 PM

The NMPA/MPA sounds like a bunch of (Insert derrogitory comment here) trying to suck more money out of the public. I think this is (I can't believe I'm saying this) and FCC problem. I think it would do everyone some good if they went in and smacked some tie wearing people around. It just honks me off that anyone would call this copywright infringement! LONG LIVE ROCK!

#53 boddhidharma

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Posted 18 July 2006 - 12:19 AM

One comment on works written before 1923; such as those by Bach, Mozart, and other classical composers. Works written before 1923 are considered public domain and are therefore immune to any action by the nmpa or mpa. They can be downloaded freely in their original forms without legal recourse. A great example of this and a further explanation of public domain can be found at www.sheetmusicarchive.net so if you are able to please put the guitar transcriptions of their works back up on the site, and consider it a small victory. thank you.

#54 lolmerule

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Posted 18 July 2006 - 01:30 AM

this is crap eventually we wont be able to tell any1 anything because well be infringing "copywright" law tabs arent against the law theyre just a bunch of numbers on lines that theyre saying are copying their music they should be thanking us for learning how to play their songs and spreading it around they should be getting ppl to stop downloading music rather than telling us to stop spreading their music via tabs. I hate big business

LOLmerule

PS:Even though i dont

#55 Nealio

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Posted 18 July 2006 - 01:34 AM

QUOTE (blackened10 @ Jul 18 2006, 04:18 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (voodoogav @ Jul 17 2006, 08:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

QUOTE (Jiveturkey @ Jul 17 2006, 10:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

QUOTE (Slayerfan @ Jul 17 2006, 03:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So, what they are telling me is that my 5th grade band teacher was a criminal for photocopying music to hand out to his students instead of buying a new copy for every student? We are not stealing music here. Sites such as this are a great way to share tablature. I just never thought being a musician would label me as a law breaker. I wonder if anyone at these so called "associations" know that they are loosing credibility? Do they even care? Keep fighting! Oh, wait...we might get in trouble for copying what Napster did by defending our own actions....

Technically yes, photocopying anything that is in print and under copywrite is illegal. Of course he's not going to be pursued or prosecuted for something so trivial but if the publishers did so wish then they would have every legal right. The tablature available on this site is differnt however as it is each person own interpretations (or so is claimed) and I highly doubt anyone could prove that they were otherwise. Also you really couldn't compare this to Napster. Napster made a serious dent in the profits of the music industry, there's no way sights like this could inflict anywhere near so much fianancial damage.


I realise this makes me sound like I'm on the side of the MPA while I must stress that I am far from that.

The problem is that this is still illegal.


HOW???

It just is. It's stupid, but in their opinion it is.

As Rob says people have been showing each other how to play famous riffs since the hills were made, but the internet is basically just another way of doing it. What's important is that internet tabs are just peoples interpretations of a song. And that's gonna be the only thing that can save the tabs.

Copyrighting has gone to hell recently too. I mean some performers are even going as far as copyrighting dance moves. If things go the way they're going, we won't be able to use a certain word because that word exists in another song.

Where do you draw the line.

BTW Rob, I can't find where to sign up after clicking the link.

#56 Jiveturkey

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Posted 18 July 2006 - 01:41 AM

QUOTE (voodoogav @ Jul 17 2006, 07:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Jiveturkey @ Jul 17 2006, 10:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

QUOTE (Slayerfan @ Jul 17 2006, 03:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So, what they are telling me is that my 5th grade band teacher was a criminal for photocopying music to hand out to his students instead of buying a new copy for every student? We are not stealing music here. Sites such as this are a great way to share tablature. I just never thought being a musician would label me as a law breaker. I wonder if anyone at these so called "associations" know that they are loosing credibility? Do they even care? Keep fighting! Oh, wait...we might get in trouble for copying what Napster did by defending our own actions....

Technically yes, photocopying anything that is in print and under copywrite is illegal. Of course he's not going to be pursued or prosecuted for something so trivial but if the publishers did so wish then they would have every legal right. The tablature available on this site is differnt however as it is each person own interpretations (or so is claimed) and I highly doubt anyone could prove that they were otherwise. Also you really couldn't compare this to Napster. Napster made a serious dent in the profits of the music industry, there's no way sights like this could inflict anywhere near so much fianancial damage.


I realise this makes me sound like I'm on the side of the MPA while I must stress that I am far from that.

The problem is that this is still illegal.

Aye true.

#57 Yahmez

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Posted 18 July 2006 - 02:37 AM

QUOTE (voodoogav @ Jul 18 2006, 07:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (blackened10 @ Jul 18 2006, 04:18 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

QUOTE (voodoogav @ Jul 17 2006, 08:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

QUOTE (Jiveturkey @ Jul 17 2006, 10:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

QUOTE (Slayerfan @ Jul 17 2006, 03:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So, what they are telling me is that my 5th grade band teacher was a criminal for photocopying music to hand out to his students instead of buying a new copy for every student? We are not stealing music here. Sites such as this are a great way to share tablature. I just never thought being a musician would label me as a law breaker. I wonder if anyone at these so called "associations" know that they are loosing credibility? Do they even care? Keep fighting! Oh, wait...we might get in trouble for copying what Napster did by defending our own actions....

Technically yes, photocopying anything that is in print and under copywrite is illegal. Of course he's not going to be pursued or prosecuted for something so trivial but if the publishers did so wish then they would have every legal right. The tablature available on this site is differnt however as it is each person own interpretations (or so is claimed) and I highly doubt anyone could prove that they were otherwise. Also you really couldn't compare this to Napster. Napster made a serious dent in the profits of the music industry, there's no way sights like this could inflict anywhere near so much fianancial damage.


I realise this makes me sound like I'm on the side of the MPA while I must stress that I am far from that.

The problem is that this is still illegal.


HOW???


Because it is someone elses intellectual property that you are attempting to reproduce. I can't take someone's play, change a few words and locations and put on a free show. I can't take someones books, change character names and hand out free copies. This is in effect what we are doing. I don't believe it should be illgeal but it is.

The main argument that can be made is that most of the tabs availible on this site are not availible as published books and the accuracy of some books is laughable. If they want people to pay for the tabs then they need a guarantee that the tab will be perfect.



So true. A mate of mine once forked out AU$40 for a tab book for jazz variations of classic songs; not only were there spelling errors all throughout the book, but there were also numerous mistakes in the (really, really poor) tabs, as well as one instance where it required you to change tuning in the middle of a bar. Ridiculous! Without blowing smoke up my arse, I've written tabs for solo jazz guitar variations of songs which are far, far superior to that which are now hosted free at GTU.

The sad part is, while it's very hard to prove that you showed your friend how to play a song, when you publish it on the internet it becomes cold hard evidence to the fact. These organisations really are going too far; I thought GTU was protected from all-o-dat because Rob is from Mexico?
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#58 ILLaViTaR

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Posted 18 July 2006 - 03:30 AM

Dammit I cant use the note E anymore
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#59 Matt B

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Posted 18 July 2006 - 04:01 AM

QUOTE (ILLaViTaR @ Jul 18 2006, 05:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Dammit I cant use the note E anymore


That's next, I'm sure.... noani.gif

#60 ConorM155

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Posted 18 July 2006 - 05:12 AM

[font=Arial Black]We Have to do something about this like what are we to do? sad.gif To stellte this problen have a nice beer drink.gif drink.gif [size=7]



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